Is MySQL more ansi compatible now?

Hi newsgroup.

I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
etc.

Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?

I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
opinions. Thanks.

On 3 Sep, 07:35, PSiegm...@mail.nu wrote:
"like an odd definition of NULL"

I'm intrigued, please explain?

PSiegmann@mail.nu wrote:
> Hi newsgroup.
>
> I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
> previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
> etc.
>
> Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
> standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
>
> I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
> opinions. Thanks.
>

From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html

MySQL is a relational database management system.

A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than putting
all the data in one big storeroom. This adds speed and flexibility. The
SQL part of “MySQL” stands for “Structured Query Language.” SQL is the
most common standardized language used to access databases and is
defined by the ANSI/ISO SQL Standard. The SQL standard has been evolving
since 1986 and several versions exist. In this manual, “SQL-92” refers
to the standard released in 1992, “SQL:1999” refers to the standard
released in 1999, and “SQL:2003” refers to the current version of the
standard. We use the phrase “the SQL standard” to mean the current
version of the SQL Standard at any time.

....and

http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...with-null.html

A.1.5.3. Problems with NULL Values

The concept of the NULL value is a common source of confusion for
newcomers to SQL, who often think that NULL is the same thing as an
empty string ''. This is not the case. For example, the following
statements are completely different:
mysql> INSERT INTO my_table (phone) VALUES (NULL);
mysql> INSERT INTO my_table (phone) VALUES ('');


....and

http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-sql-mode.html

Norm


Norm

> > I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
> > previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
> > etc.
> >
> > Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
> > standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
> >
> > I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
> > opinions. Thanks.
> >
>
> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
>
> MySQL is a relational database management system.
>
> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than putting
> all the data in one big storeroom.

"one big storeroom"?

What would that be? :-)


--
Martijn Tonies
Database Workbench - tool for InterBase, Firebird, MySQL, NexusDB, Oracle &
MS SQL Server
Upscene Productions
http://www.upscene.com
My thoughts:
http://blog.upscene.com/martijn/
Database development questions? Check the forum!
http://www.databasedevelopmentforum.com

"Martijn Tonies" <m.tonies@upscene.removethis.com> wrote in message
news:46dc19f9$0$32206$e4fe514c@dreader22.news.xs4a ll.nl...
>
>> > I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
>> > previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
>> > etc.
>> >
>> > Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
>> > standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
>> >
>> > I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
>> > opinions. Thanks.
>> >
>>
>> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
>>
>> MySQL is a relational database management system.
>>
>> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than putting
>> all the data in one big storeroom.
>
> "one big storeroom"?
>
> What would that be? :-)

Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
instead of a separate file for each.

--
Tony Marston

http://www.tonymarston.net
http://www.radicore.org



> --
> Martijn Tonies
> Database Workbench - tool for InterBase, Firebird, MySQL, NexusDB, Oracle
> &
> MS SQL Server
> Upscene Productions
> http://www.upscene.com
> My thoughts:
> http://blog.upscene.com/martijn/
> Database development questions? Check the forum!
> http://www.databasedevelopmentforum.com
>
>

Tony Marston wrote :

>> "one big storeroom"?
>>
>> What would that be? :-)
>
> Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
> instead of a separate file for each.

Like the MySQL InnoDB engine ;)

--
Hugo

> >> > I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
> >> > previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
> >> > etc.
> >> >
> >> > Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
> >> > standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
> >> >
> >> > I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
> >> > opinions. Thanks.
> >> >
> >>
> >> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
> >>
> >> MySQL is a relational database management system.
> >>
> >> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than
putting
> >> all the data in one big storeroom.
> >
> > "one big storeroom"?
> >
> > What would that be? :-)
>
> Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
> instead of a separate file for each.

Both solutions have nothing to do with the phrase "relational database
management system".

How "tables" are stored is a physical implementation detail.

So I still wonder what "one big storeroom" is :-)


--
Martijn Tonies
Database Workbench - tool for InterBase, Firebird, MySQL, NexusDB, Oracle &
MS SQL Server
Upscene Productions
http://www.upscene.com
My thoughts:
http://blog.upscene.com/martijn/
Database development questions? Check the forum!
http://www.databasedevelopmentforum.com

Martijn Tonies wrote:
>>>>> I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
>>>>> previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
>>>>> etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
>>>>> standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
>>>>>
>>>>> I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
>>>>> opinions. Thanks.
>>>>>
>>>> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
>>>>
>>>> MySQL is a relational database management system.
>>>>
>>>> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than
> putting
>>>> all the data in one big storeroom.
>>> "one big storeroom"?
>>>
>>> What would that be? :-)
>> Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
>> instead of a separate file for each.
>
> Both solutions have nothing to do with the phrase "relational database
> management system".
>
> How "tables" are stored is a physical implementation detail.
>
> So I still wonder what "one big storeroom" is :-)
>
>

Instead of putting all data into one big box (table), it can be
spread out into smaller boxes (tables) that are easier to search through.

Norm

> >>>>> I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
> >>>>> previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
> >>>>> etc.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
> >>>>> standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
> >>>>> opinions. Thanks.
> >>>>>
> >>>> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
> >>>>
> >>>> MySQL is a relational database management system.
> >>>>
> >>>> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than
> > putting
> >>>> all the data in one big storeroom.
> >>> "one big storeroom"?
> >>>
> >>> What would that be? :-)
> >> Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
> >> instead of a separate file for each.
> >
> > Both solutions have nothing to do with the phrase "relational database
> > management system".
> >
> > How "tables" are stored is a physical implementation detail.
> >
> > So I still wonder what "one big storeroom" is :-)
> >
> >
>
> Instead of putting all data into one big box (table), it can be
> spread out into smaller boxes (tables) that are easier to search through.

??

this has to do with data normalization, not with being a RDBMS or not.

There are plenty of systems before RDBMS that use "file of record" or
whatever, and having multiple files etc...


I would say that the statement from the manuals is complete bogus.


--
Martijn Tonies
Database Workbench - tool for InterBase, Firebird, MySQL, NexusDB, Oracle &
MS SQL Server
Upscene Productions
http://www.upscene.com
My thoughts:
http://blog.upscene.com/martijn/
Database development questions? Check the forum!
http://www.databasedevelopmentforum.com

> >>>>> I haven't looked into MySQL version 5, but I can remember that
> >>>>> previous versions had alot of quirks, like an odd definition of NULL
> >>>>> etc.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Is this better now? PostgreSQL was always regarded as the more
> >>>>> standard complaint DB, has MySQL closed the gap?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I am deciding currently what to take - PSQL or MySQL, and need some
> >>>>> opinions. Thanks.
> >>>>>
> >>>> From http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/...-is-mysql.html
> >>>>
> >>>> MySQL is a relational database management system.
> >>>>
> >>>> A relational database stores data in separate tables rather than
> > putting
> >>>> all the data in one big storeroom.
> >>> "one big storeroom"?
> >>>
> >>> What would that be? :-)
> >> Some database systems store all the tables and indeces in one big file
> >> instead of a separate file for each.
> >
> > Both solutions have nothing to do with the phrase "relational database
> > management system".
> >
> > How "tables" are stored is a physical implementation detail.
> >
> > So I still wonder what "one big storeroom" is :-)
> >
> >
>
> Instead of putting all data into one big box (table), it can be
> spread out into smaller boxes (tables) that are easier to search through.

??

this has to do with data normalization, not with being a RDBMS or not.

There are plenty of systems before RDBMS that use "file of record" or
whatever, and having multiple files etc...


I would say that the statement from the manuals is complete bogus.

Continueing on this: a RDBMS doesn't have to "store" data in "tables"
either. It has to return "resultsets" of data gotten from "relations". How
this data is actually stored behind the scenes is of no importance. If
you design a table, and the data is stored (physically on disk) in some
sort of linked list, it would be fine, as long as the software makes it so
that you can get the data in resultsets and it has metadata that resemble
a table.


--
Martijn Tonies
Database Workbench - tool for InterBase, Firebird, MySQL, NexusDB, Oracle &
MS SQL Server
Upscene Productions
http://www.upscene.com
My thoughts:
http://blog.upscene.com/martijn/
Database development questions? Check the forum!
http://www.databasedevelopmentforum.com